Chat Log: August 4th 2007

Aug 04 11:26:44 * Lensman (~lensman@ has joined #knownspace

Aug 04 11:39:54 <Lensman> Oh, give me a locus where the gravitons focus/ Where the three-body problem is solved,/ Where the microwaves play down at three degrees K,/ And the cold virus never evolved.

Aug 04 11:40:53 <Lensman> CHORUS: Home, home on LaGrange,/ Where the space debris always collects,/ We possess, so it seems, two of Man's greatest dreams:/ Solar power and zero-gee sex.

Aug 04 11:42:07 <Lensman> We eat algea pie, our vacuum is high,/ Our ball bearings are perfectly round./ Our horizon is curved, our warheads are MIRVed,/ And a kilogram weighs half a pound./ (chorus)

Aug 04 11:43:51 <Lensman> If we run out of space for our burgeoning race/ No more Lebensraum left for the Mensch/ When we're ready to start, we can take Mars apart,/ If we just find a big enough wrench./ (chorus)

Aug 04 11:45:35 <Lensman> I'm sick of this place, it's just McDonald's in space,/ And living up here is a bore./ Tell the shiggies, "Don't cry," they can kiss me goodbye/ 'Cause I'm moving next week to L4!/ (chorus)

Aug 04 11:47:05 <Lensman> --"Home on Lagrange" (The L5 Song) by William S. Higgins and Barry D. Gehm

Aug 04 12:56:32 * NickE (~NickE@ has joined #knownspace

Aug 04 12:57:43 <NickE> (not at computer for a while: Hi)

Aug 04 13:05:08 <Lensman> Hi Nick!

Aug 04 13:47:16 <NickE> BAck briefly. Will be in and out most likely this evening

Aug 04 13:47:37 <NickE> 6.43 pm here

Aug 04 13:48:09 <Lensman> 12:42 pm here

Aug 04 13:48:23 <NickE> Lunchtime then :-)

Aug 04 13:48:39 <NickE> Tea time soon for me

Aug 04 13:49:19 <NickE> So,Lens, you've read teh FOW ARC?

Aug 04 13:49:32 <NickE> (or "a" ARC

Aug 04 13:49:33 <Lensman> Do you "do lunch" there? Or just wait for tea time?

Aug 04 13:50:03 <NickE> depends how common you are :-)

Aug 04 13:50:04 <Lensman> Yes I'm one of the lucky few to have read FOW, and I must say it's very frustrating as I can't talk about it with anyone!

Aug 04 13:50:38 <NickE> Hmmm, I can't I want to find out for myself,so also frustrating! :-)

Aug 04 13:51:29 <Lensman> Yes, well I can't tell you that the Tnuctipun turn out to be Kzinti, and that Kzanol was just a genetic construct, and... Oh, wait, wrong story!

Aug 04 13:52:08 <NickE> <grin>

Aug 04 13:52:16 <NickE> DiF yes?

Aug 04 13:52:24 <Lensman> Yup.

Aug 04 13:53:40 <Lensman> Seriously, it's interesting how the authors have tied in elements from different stories into this one. Retconning in a *good* way. Not changing what's stipulated in other stories, but adding things and connections that hadn't been revealed before.

Aug 04 13:54:36 <NickE> Thats good, Ed and Larry both have hinted at that sort of thing. I'm just glad to be looking fwd to 2 new KS novels#

Aug 04 13:56:31 <NickE> Not finding much time for reading these days (well, not as much as I'd like), but these I'll clear space for

Aug 04 13:58:24 <Lensman> Yes indeed. And the cover of FoW is awesome! It's really interesting how much SF cover art has improved. I remember when Rick Sternbach was doing Niven covers. Back then he was a great improvement over most covers on Larry's books. And while I still think Sternbach is an excellent artist, this Steve Martiniere guy blows his stuff away! First /Ringworld's Children/, then /Draco Tavern/, now FOW. *Wonderful* covers!

Aug 04 13:58:42 <NickE> I'll probably log out in a while and come back on the laptop after dinner,so ther might be a gap, but I'll be back

Aug 04 13:59:08 <NickE> I love Steven Martiniere's covers. Excellent no question

Aug 04 13:59:29 <Lensman> The smells coming from the kitchen are quite tempting... but I'll just put my spaghetti in the microwave and eat at the computer.

Aug 04 13:59:44 <NickE> Risky!

Aug 04 13:59:47 <NickE> :-)

Aug 04 14:00:39 <Lensman> No risk is too great for a Niven chat! :)

Aug 04 14:02:23 <NickE> Heh. Gonna split for a while but will stay logged on here for now.L8R

Aug 04 14:02:42 <Lensman> L8R

Aug 04 14:46:42 <NickE> logging out,back shortly on laptop (basically so I can watch a DVD with teh family :-)

Aug 04 14:46:48 * NickE has quit ()

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Aug 04 14:51:19 <NickE> back

Aug 04 14:51:49 <NickE> quiet tonight no?

Aug 04 14:52:16 <NickE> holiday season I guess

Aug 04 14:56:18 <Lensman> Is NaSFic this weekend?

Aug 04 14:56:43 <NickE> Wouldnt know

Aug 04 14:57:53 <Lensman> Yah, it is. Dunno if that's why it's so quiet, but perhaps that's part of it.

Aug 04 15:10:28 <NickE> sorry, only checking back every 10 mins or so

Aug 04 15:17:59 <Lensman> S'alright, I'm playing Civilization II.

Aug 04 15:23:05 <NickE> Watching Angel and catching up on a couple of boards :-)

Aug 04 16:09:08 <Lensman> There's an interesting program on the Science Channel right now, about dinosaurs and early mammals.

Aug 04 16:17:37 <NickE> Onto The 5th Element now here

Aug 04 16:43:41 <NickE> gonna bail. Tired. Next time. May check latr

Aug 04 16:43:44 * NickE has quit (Quit: *g0ne*)

Aug 04 17:33:25 <SeanS> hmm, low turn out

Aug 04 17:48:35 * NickE (~NickE@ has joined #knownspace

Aug 04 17:50:02 * NickE has quit ()

Aug 04 17:50:23 <Lensman> Are you there Sean?

Aug 04 17:51:42 <Lensman> Well, I'll keep checking back periodically.

Aug 04 17:56:35 <SeanS> i am

Aug 04 18:02:13 <Lensman> So, how did the "Sooby recovery network" go? :)

Aug 04 18:03:00 <SeanS> huh?

Aug 04 18:03:39 <SeanS> what are you talking about/

Aug 04 18:03:41 <SeanS> ?

Aug 04 18:03:47 <Lensman> I peeked into this chat room a week or 2 ago and the greeting line said something like "Welcome to the Sooby recovery network" :)

Aug 04 18:04:02 <SeanS> i dont know

Aug 04 18:04:08 <SeanS> anybody can change the topic

Aug 04 18:05:02 <Lensman> Not sure if that was intended to be recovery from my numerous frequent posts, or the sudden cessation of the same over the past couple of months as other fanac has taken up my time.

Aug 04 18:05:21 <Lensman> Or both. :)

Aug 04 18:05:57 <SeanS> no idea... since i am in here all the time, i rarely see topic changes. i only see them when i leave and come back

Aug 04 18:06:10 <Lensman> So, is everybody at Nasfic, or what's going on?

Aug 04 18:06:38 <SeanS> dont know.. i am just in for another hour or so before my gf and i go to a birthday dinner

Aug 04 18:06:54 <SeanS> kinda sucks... i wanted to hang out on the river longer and drink more beer

Aug 04 18:07:05 <Lensman> I know William Warren is at Nasfic. Dunno how many other chat room regulars are.

Aug 04 18:07:35 <Lensman> So what cut your trip short?

Aug 04 18:07:55 <SeanS> well the river is over my shoulder... so not a trip so to speak

Aug 04 18:08:15 <Lensman> Color me confused.

Aug 04 18:08:35 <SeanS> a birthday dinner that i am going to in about an hour and 15 minutes

Aug 04 18:09:02 <SeanS> if i look out the door, i see my beach

Aug 04 18:09:27 <Lensman> Is "the river" where you live, or do you have your laptop with you where you're staying, or what?

Aug 04 18:09:39 <SeanS> i live on the kentucky river

Aug 04 18:10:19 <SeanS> my yard is a beach on the river where lots of boats pull in every weekend

Aug 04 18:10:30 <SeanS> and a several boats pull in during the week

Aug 04 18:10:57 <Lensman> Sounds wonderful. Is the fishing good there?

Aug 04 18:11:12 <SeanS> its fairly good

Aug 04 18:11:29 <SeanS> i take some chicken liver down every few days and catch catfish for dinner

Aug 04 18:12:01 <Lensman> I used to love catfish when I was young.

Aug 04 18:13:07 <SeanS> i catch catfish off the beach but for bass or crappie, i have to go across the river

Aug 04 18:13:19 <SeanS> different topography

Aug 04 18:13:47 <Lensman> Or bottomography?

Aug 04 18:14:10 <SeanS> sand on this side, rock and stick ups on the other side... call it what you will

Aug 04 18:14:21 <Lensman> I confess I'm not 'nuff of a fisherman to know where to fish for what.

Aug 04 18:14:31 <SeanS> i am

Aug 04 18:14:54 <SeanS> lived on this river for over 30 years

Aug 04 18:15:47 <Lensman> My family used to go fishing at a county lake, we'd catch small stuff like perch. I once caught a 22" catfish, but it was in a stocked pond, so not much challenge there.

Aug 04 18:16:05 <Lensman> I confess I never really saw the appeal of fishing.

Aug 04 18:16:25 <Lensman> Now fly-fishing, that sounds like a challenge, that might be fun.

Aug 04 18:16:48 <SeanS> the biggest fresh water fish i have caught that was worth anything was a 13.5 pound bass from orange lake in north central florida

Aug 04 18:17:55 <SeanS> well, the apeal of fishing for me is it puts food on the table... i dont catch and release. dumbest thing i have ever heard of

Aug 04 18:18:46 <Lensman> I was quite young when I caught that huge cat. My uncle waded out with a net into the shallows and captured the fish. I was literally stunned to see how large a fish I'd caught. Quite different than the small carp and perch I was used to!

Aug 04 18:20:44 <Lensman> Ah, a practical man. Makes more sense to me than "sport" fishing.

Aug 04 18:21:03 <SeanS> the only reason i release is do to size limits

Aug 04 18:21:09 <SeanS> due

Aug 04 18:22:30 <Lensman> I think I'll check the Nasfic site to see if the name "Niven" appears on the schedule.

Aug 04 18:23:56 <SeanS> k

Aug 04 18:24:47 <Lensman> Well, he's not on any panels.

Aug 04 18:26:23 <SeanS> where is nasfic

Aug 04 18:26:24 <Lensman> And he's not scheduled for autographs. So apparently he's not gonna be there.

Aug 04 18:26:32 <Lensman> Saint Louis.

Aug 04 18:26:41 <SeanS> dont go over a bridge

Aug 04 18:26:59 <Lensman> LOL!

Aug 04 18:27:22 <Lensman> It's certainly close enough, just 4 hours driving time. I wish I had the money to go!

Aug 04 18:27:34 <SeanS> it took a whopping 30 seconds for that to be blamed on bush

Aug 04 18:28:15 <Lensman> On CNN this morning they said they still don't know what caused the bridge collapse. No instant gratification, frustrated newsies.

Aug 04 18:29:02 <SeanS> yeah, but as i understand it there are news crews fillming every bridge in the country for more doom and gloom

Aug 04 18:29:26 <Lensman> I think they said there were reports part of the bridge was vibrating before the collapse. That sounds very strange for a *concrete* bridge.

Aug 04 18:31:11 <SeanS> well, not really

Aug 04 18:31:19 <Lensman> Oh?

Aug 04 18:31:49 <SeanS> anything vibrates. its the stress points during the vibration you have to worry aboy

Aug 04 18:31:50 <SeanS> about

Aug 04 18:32:40 <SeanS> prestressed concrete will vibrate a lot. very rigid.. the more rigid the more vibration

Aug 04 18:33:33 <SeanS> wont shake much but still vibrate

Aug 04 18:34:44 <Lensman> There is, or was, one bridge here in Kansas City, Kansas which was a truss bridge. No concrete or asphalt, the roadway was a grid of steel. It was an odd sensation driving across, because there was no asphalt or steel for the tires to grip, and the car would veer from side to side, I suppose following the angle of the diagonals in the steel grid. But if traffic was backed up, when you stopped on the bridge it always swayed in an alarming fashion. V

Aug 04 18:35:19 <SeanS> yep, have the same thing here called the 'singing bridge'

Aug 04 18:35:56 <SeanS> an engineer that i know refuses to drive over it

Aug 04 18:36:04 <Lensman> BOGGLE! We also call *ours* "the singing bridge" !

Aug 04 18:36:18 <Lensman> That's not good...

Aug 04 18:36:50 <Lensman> Actually they finally put an asphalt roadway on it, so it no longer "sings".

Aug 04 18:36:52 <SeanS> 9 ton limit and during 4:30 traffic, it is totally full of cars

Aug 04 18:38:42 <Lensman> I do seem to recall when stopped on a concrete bridge there would be an occasional "bump" as a heavy truck drove past, but I never recall feeling a swaying motion. But then, what was described on the news report was "vibration" and not "swaying".

Aug 04 18:40:06 <SeanS> you will always feel a bump when a heavy truck goes over the expansion joints

Aug 04 18:45:51 <Lensman> So, who's birthday?

Aug 04 18:46:07 <SeanS> stacy's

Aug 04 18:46:16 <Lensman> ...or even, "Whose b-day?"

Aug 04 18:46:18 <SeanS> i am sure that means nothing to you ;)

Aug 04 18:46:20 <Lensman> Is that the gf?

Aug 04 18:46:33 <SeanS> a good friend's wife

Aug 04 18:46:53 <Lensman> Well, no, but grasping at straws for a conversational subject here...

Aug 04 18:47:48 <SeanS> normally, they would have a party but she is pregnant and they are going to have to take the baby early

Aug 04 18:48:27 <SeanS> easier to do things at a nuetral site where if she gets tired, she can go home

Aug 04 18:50:18 <Lensman> We've been having some interesting conversations on the Piper list. One guy raised the hoary old objection to FTL travel as violating simultaneity. I pointed out that simulteneity has been violated with entangled particles. I thought that was a recent experiment, but when I Googled it I found it was 10 years ago!

Aug 04 18:51:20 <Lensman> So non-simultaneity isn't quite as hoary as phlostigen or the aether, but it's getting there...

Aug 04 18:53:27 <Lensman> Oh, I should have said "FTL travel as violating *non*-simultaneity".

Aug 04 19:09:13 <SeanS> well, off to dinner

Aug 04 19:09:44 <SeanS> well, a beer and then off to dinner but i am out

Aug 04 19:14:04 <Lensman> Nite.