Chat Log: January 8th, 2011

[01:06] Growler has joined #knownspace
[01:06] growler_ has joined #knownspace
[01:07] #knownspace> Growler: Thid is a test from my cellphone
[01:07] #knownspace> growler_: this is a test from my laptop
[01:07] #knownspace> Growler: All good
[01:07] #knownspace> growler_: All good
[04:37] Akiraa has joined #knownspace
[04:39] #knownspace> Akiraa: Link
[04:40] #knownspace> Akiraa: someone has a patent on a laser pointer for playing with a cat
[09:28] ericholtman has joined #knownspace
[09:46] #knownspace> sean: Yeah, Akiraa, they sell them here as pet exercise tools.
[13:11] Jim has joined #knownspace
[13:20] #knownspace> Jim: ls -l
[13:24] #knownspace> SeanS: ;)
[13:25] #knownspace> SeanS: ps -A
[13:26] #knownspace> Jim: chmod u+x suck_it_trebeck
[13:27] #knownspace> SeanS: lol
[13:29] unclenasty has joined #knownspace
[13:30] #knownspace> unclenasty: mornin all
[13:30] #knownspace> unclenasty: well, afternoon
[13:31] #knownspace> ericholtman: morning somwhere
[13:31] #knownspace> unclenasty: hey eric
[13:31] #knownspace> Jim: morning is the time that you get out of bed; 1300 hours EST for me
[13:31] #knownspace> unclenasty: hi jim
[13:31] #knownspace> unclenasty: yeah, on EST here
[13:32] #knownspace> unclenasty: hi Outsider
[13:32] #knownspace> Outsider: Hi unclenasty
[13:32] #knownspace> Jim: hi
[13:32] #knownspace> unclenasty: .weather CYYZ
[13:32] #knownspace> Outsider: Cover Unknown, ?, ?mb, C CA, (wind unknown) - CYYZ, 13:00, 1800Z
[13:32] #knownspace> unclenasty: well, that's informative
[13:32] #knownspace> Jim: we got snow
[13:32] #knownspace> ericholtman: is outsider a bot?
[13:32] #knownspace> unclenasty: yeah, he's a phenny derivative
[13:34] #knownspace> unclenasty: .biblio character Louis Wu
[13:34] #knownspace> Outsider: IOError: [Errno socket error] [Errno -2] Name or service not known (file "/usr/lib/python2.6/socket.py", line 498, in create_connection)
[13:34] #knownspace> SeanS: .weather 40601
[13:34] #knownspace> unclenasty: bum
[13:34] #knownspace> Outsider: Clear ☼, 19.4℉ (-7℃), 29.85in (1007mb), Moderate breeze 11kt (↑) - KLOU 12:53, 1753Z
[13:34] #knownspace> unclenasty: i think he's lost his link to the bibliography
[13:34] #knownspace> Jim: weather 26287
[13:34] #knownspace> SeanS: put a period in front of it
[13:35] #knownspace> Jim: .weather 26287
[13:35] #knownspace> Outsider: Cloudy, 17.6℉ (-8℃), 29.49in (995mb), Unknown Precipitation, Moderate breeze 11kt (↑) - KEKN, 13:25, 1825Z
[13:37] #knownspace> unclenasty: ARM is a bot as well, but it just logs the channel to file
[13:38] #knownspace> unclenasty: i need to put a script in to gzip the old chat files
[13:38] #knownspace> ericholtman: how big can they be?
[13:38] #knownspace> unclenasty: it's not that they're big, it's just it logs all the time with a new file each day
[13:39] #knownspace> unclenasty: day to day they're maybe a couple hundred bytes or a couple of k if there's any discussion
[13:39] #knownspace> SeanS: pretty sure it deletes them after like 4 months or something
[13:39] #knownspace> unclenasty: a saturday chat is about 50k or so
[13:40] #knownspace> unclenasty: it does, I just don't want to hog brennan's drive space
[13:45] #knownspace> SeanS: what we need to do is backup the whole box sometime
[13:45] #knownspace> SeanS: that pc is not getting any younger
[13:46] #knownspace> unclenasty: true - the irc config would be a pain to re-do
[13:47] #knownspace> SeanS: I picked up a 500 gig external we could back it up to.
[13:48] #knownspace> unclenasty: i'll put a tar'd backup in /backups
[13:49] #knownspace> unclenasty: then we just have one file to copy over
[13:49] #knownspace> unclenasty: what format is the 500gb drive?
[13:50] #knownspace> SeanS: ntfs i would guess. windows can read it
[13:50] #knownspace> SeanS: it came preformatted
[13:50] #knownspace> unclenasty: ok, if it's FAT we may have issues... 4GB file size limit
[13:50] #knownspace> SeanS: let me go look
[13:52] #knownspace> SeanS: ntfs
[13:53] #knownspace> ericholtman: people still use FAT?
[13:54] #knownspace> unclenasty: eric, people still use dos
[13:55] #knownspace> SeanS: i use dos box ;)
[13:55] #knownspace> ericholtman: I meant, like, for preformatting a drive.
[13:55] #knownspace> unclenasty: we have amachine in one warehouse we cannot swap out or upgrade from windows 95 as a client insists on using a system which has not been updated since 1997 and will not run on 98 or higher
[13:55] #knownspace> ericholtman: i prefer 8" floppies for my backups
[13:56] #knownspace> unclenasty: heh
[13:56] #knownspace> unclenasty: yeah, most flash drives come with fat32
[13:57] #knownspace> unclenasty: which still has the 4gb limit
[13:57] #knownspace> SeanS: yep
[13:57] #knownspace> unclenasty: i'll launch the backup script later sean. no need to slow the machine down with a chat due
[13:57] #knownspace> SeanS: i agree
[13:58] #knownspace> unclenasty: ahh
[13:58] #knownspace> unclenasty: just figured out why biblio isn't working
[13:59] Outsider has joined #knownspace
[13:59] #knownspace> unclenasty: hi Outsider
[13:59] #knownspace> Outsider: Hola unclenasty:)
[13:59] #knownspace> unclenasty: .biblio character louis wu
[13:59] #knownspace> Outsider: unclenasty: That information will cost you one trillion stars.
[13:59] #knownspace> unclenasty: smartass
[14:00] #knownspace> ericholtman: maybe we can get bernanke to print up some stars
[14:01] #knownspace> unclenasty: .msg Outsider .biblio puppeteer
[14:01] #knownspace> unclenasty: <sigh>
[14:03] #knownspace> unclenasty: ha!
[14:03] #knownspace> unclenasty: .biblio characters chmee
[14:03] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld Engineers, The (1979-07): First evidence of the Pak on the Ringworld 1st Sequel to Ringworld
[14:03] #knownspace> unclenasty: .biblio notes pak
[14:03] #knownspace> Outsider: Protector (1973-09): Brand-new assumption introduced to Known Space: humanity is descended from the Pak. The novel 's second section is called "Vandervecken," and takes place in 2340. The first part is Adults, The
[14:03] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld Engineers, The (1979-07): First evidence of the Pak on the Ringworld 1st Sequel to Ringworld
[14:03] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld Throne, The (1996-06): Louis encounters more Pak Protectors 2nd sequel to Ringworld
[14:04] #knownspace> unclenasty: there we go
[14:04] #knownspace> unclenasty: .biblio ringworld
[14:04] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld (1970-10) : Niven's best-known novel brings together Nessus & Louis Wu from previous Known Space stories Ringworld has spawned 3 sequels and a role-playing game, among other things. Though it was first printed in 1970, it appears farther down the list in Niven's published bibliographies.
[14:04] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld Engineers, The (1979-07): First evidence of the Pak on the Ringworld 1st Sequel to Ringworld
[14:04] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld Retrospective (1989-04): Like the title says. A look back at the impact of Ringworld.
[14:04] #knownspace> Outsider: Foreword to The Guide to Larry Niven's Ringworld (1994-02): A brief discussion of the Ringworld and how it's been re-engineered by fans, both professional and amateur, over the years.
[14:04] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld Throne, The (1996-06): Louis encounters more Pak Protectors 2nd sequel to Ringworld
[14:04] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld's Children (2004-06) : 3rd Sequel to Ringworld
[14:04] #knownspace> unclenasty: :-)
[14:04] #knownspace> Outsider: Preface to Ringworld's Children (2004-06): further discussion of Ringworld's literary and physical parameters
[14:04] #knownspace> unclenasty: .biblio
[14:04] #knownspace> Outsider: unclenasty: .biblio what?
[14:04] #knownspace> unclenasty: brb
[14:12] NickE has joined #knownspace
[14:13] #knownspace> NickE: in, but busy. back in about 45
[14:24] Fred has joined #knownspace
[14:26] #knownspace> Fred: Greets peeps
[14:26] #knownspace> Jim: Fred!
[14:27] #knownspace> Fred: Jim!
[14:28] #knownspace> SeanS: Hey, Fred
[14:29] #knownspace> Akiraa: hello, what time is it?
[14:30] #knownspace> Akiraa: .biblio help
[14:30] #knownspace> Outsider: Akiraa: That information will cost you one trillion stars.
[14:30] #knownspace> Fred: 12:30 where I am
[14:30] #knownspace> Fred: hey Sean
[14:30] #knownspace> unclenasty: i back
[14:30] #knownspace> Fred: U.N.
[14:31] #knownspace> Akiraa: one trillion stars? is that Ra/Dec or galactic coordinates?
[14:31] #knownspace> Akiraa: well, I have a database in celestia of about a billion stars
[14:32] #knownspace> unclenasty: Akiraa, the command is .biblio [title|published|date|reprints|characters|awards|notes] <search term>

[14:32] #knownspace> unclenasty: so:
[14:32] #knownspace> unclenasty: .biblio character chmee
[14:32] #knownspace> Outsider: unclenasty: That information will cost you one trillion stars.
[14:32] #knownspace> unclenasty: .biblio characters chmee
[14:32] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld Engineers, The (1979-07): First evidence of the Pak on the Ringworld 1st Sequel to Ringworld
[14:32] #knownspace> unclenasty: if I could type
[14:32] #knownspace> Akiraa: .biblio character louis wu
[14:32] #knownspace> Outsider: Akiraa: That information will cost you one trillion stars.
[14:32] #knownspace> unclenasty: characters
[14:33] #knownspace> Akiraa: .biblio character "louis wu"
[14:33] #knownspace> Outsider: Akiraa: That information will cost you one trillion stars.
[14:33] #knownspace> Akiraa: .biblio character louis
[14:33] #knownspace> unclenasty: .biblio characters louis wu
[14:33] #knownspace> Outsider: Akiraa: That information will cost you one trillion stars.
[14:33] #knownspace> Outsider: There is a Tide (1968-06): First appearance of Louis Wu and his "sabbaticals," as well as Trinocs.
[14:33] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld (1970-10): Niven's best-known novel brings together Nessus & Louis Wu from previous Known Space stories Ringworld has spawned 3 sequels and a role-playing game, among other things. Though it was first printed in 1970, it appears farther down the list in Niven's published bibliographies.
[14:33] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld Engineers, The (1979-07): First evidence of the Pak on the Ringworld 1st Sequel to Ringworld
[14:33] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld Throne, The (1996-06): Louis encounters more Pak Protectors 2nd sequel to Ringworld
[14:33] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld's Children (2004-06): 3rd Sequel to Ringworld
[14:33] #knownspace> Outsider: Betrayer of Worlds (2010-10): Newest collaboration with Ed Lerner
[14:34] #knownspace> Akiraa: betrayer of worlds, that's a new one, must look for it
[14:34] #knownspace> unclenasty: .biblio notes general products
[14:34] #knownspace> Outsider: unclenasty: That information will cost you one trillion stars.
[14:34] #knownspace> Akiraa: .biblio answer to life, the universe and everything
[14:34] #knownspace> unclenasty: that's just his default "no results" message if you hadn't figured
[14:34] #knownspace> Outsider: Akiraa: That information will cost you one trillion stars.
[14:34] #knownspace> unclenasty: .google answer to life, the universe and everything
[14:35] #knownspace> ericholtman: so how can you know if Outsider really *does* know, but wants the trillion stars?
[14:35] #knownspace> unclenasty: i'll leave that one to the philosophers
[14:35] #knownspace> Fred: That information will cost you one trillion stars.
[14:35] #knownspace> Akiraa: Can you read Betrayer of Worlds as a standalone novel? I haven't read the Fleet of Worlds series, just Ringworld
[14:35] #knownspace> Fred: Hmm. You *could*
[14:36] #knownspace> Fred: Not sure if you *should*
[14:36] #knownspace> ericholtman: i really wouldn't recommend it.
[14:36] #knownspace> unclenasty: .biblio notes kzin
[14:36] #knownspace> Outsider: Scatterbrain (2003-01) : Collection Info Niven's career from 1990 to 2003. Contents:Excerpt from Destiny's Road
[14:36] #knownspace> Fred: if all you've read is Ringworld, there's a lot I'd read first before Betrayer
[14:36] #knownspace> Outsider: Scatterbrain (2003-01) : Collection Info Niven's career from 1990 to 2003. Contents:Excerpt from Destiny's Road
[14:36] #knownspace> Outsider: Warriors, The (1966-02) : 1st Man-Kzin War story
[14:36] #knownspace> Outsider: Slaver Weapon, The (1973-12) : Airdate Dec. 15, 1973. This script (and the book adaptation that followed) sparked the ongoing debate about the existence of Kzinti in the Star Trek universe. Based on Soft Weapon, The
[14:36] #knownspace> Outsider: Madness Has Its Place (1990-08) : First Known Space story since The Ringworld Engineers in 1979 describes Sol's first response to the Kzin invasion
[14:36] #knownspace> Outsider: Choosing Names (1998-09) : New Man-Kzin story
[14:37] #knownspace> Akiraa: Betrayer of Worlds happens how long after the events of Ringworld?
[14:37] #knownspace> unclenasty: the biblio module on Outsider is a very simple link into this http://news.larryniven.net/biblio/main.asp
[14:38] #knownspace> unclenasty: all it does is parse the returned html into text for IRC
[14:38] #knownspace> Akiraa: .biblio character chmee
[14:38] #knownspace> Outsider: Akiraa: That information will cost you one trillion stars.
[14:38] nedry has joined #knownspace
[14:38] #knownspace> Akiraa: .biblio character speaker
[14:38] #knownspace> Outsider: Akiraa: That information will cost you one trillion stars.
[14:38] #knownspace> unclenasty: Akiraa, characters
[14:38] #knownspace> Akiraa: .biblio characters chmee
[14:38] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld Engineers, The (1979-07): First evidence of the Pak on the Ringworld 1st Sequel to Ringworld
[14:38] #knownspace> unclenasty: you're missing the s
[14:38] #knownspace> nedry: hello everyone
[14:38] #knownspace> Akiraa: Shouldn't Chmee show up as Speaker as well?
[14:39] #knownspace> unclenasty: hey mark
[14:39] #knownspace> nedry: hey 'nasty.
[14:39] #knownspace> unclenasty: .biblio characters speaker
[14:39] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld (1970-10): Niven's best-known novel brings together Nessus & Louis Wu from previous Known Space stories Ringworld has spawned 3 sequels and a role-playing game, among other things. Though it was first printed in 1970, it appears farther down the list in Niven's published bibliographies.
[14:39] #knownspace> Akiraa: .biblio characters hindmost
[14:39] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld Engineers, The (1979-07): First evidence of the Pak on the Ringworld 1st Sequel to Ringworld
[14:39] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld Throne, The (1996-06): Louis encounters more Pak Protectors 2nd sequel to Ringworld
[14:39] #knownspace> Outsider: Ringworld's Children (2004-06): 3rd Sequel to Ringworld
[14:39] #knownspace> nedry: i love that!
[14:40] #knownspace> unclenasty: there's way more information returned, but trying to send it without spamming the channel is tricky
[14:40] #knownspace> SeanS: its pretty sweet.
[14:40] #knownspace> unclenasty: like I say, on its own it's not much without this http://news.larryniven.net/biblio/main.asp
[14:40] #knownspace> Akiraa: you can "/msg Outsider characters chmee" instead of using the main channel
[14:41] #knownspace> Akiraa: "/msg Outsider .biblio characters chmee"
[14:41] #knownspace> unclenasty: it's just a simple form submit parsed to display in the irc channel
[14:41] #knownspace> Fred: Betrayer takes place before Ringworld, a
[14:41] #knownspace> Fred: Akiraa
[14:41] #knownspace> Fred: It's a prequel
[14:41] #knownspace> unclenasty: true, but then I'd have to figure out how to make the module detect a private message as opposed to open channel
[14:42] #knownspace> unclenasty: which I suspect is do-able, it's just not there right now
[14:42] #knownspace> Akiraa: So Louis' dealings with the puppeteers go before Ringworld, but in the novel it was said they were out of contact for a few centuries
[14:43] #knownspace> Fred: Well, it's hard to explain without massive spoilers
[14:43] #knownspace> unclenasty: is anyone using the flash irc client?
[14:43] #knownspace> SeanS: i used it a couple of days ago
[14:44] #knownspace> Akiraa: any chances of a direct sequel to Ringworld?
[14:44] #knownspace> Fred: there are 3 already Akiraa
[14:44] #knownspace> unclenasty: ringworld engineers?
[14:44] #knownspace> SeanS: yeah... ringworld engineers
[14:44] #knownspace> Akiraa: I mean the series, after Children
[14:44] #knownspace> Fred: oh
[14:44] #knownspace> Fred: no idea
[14:44] #knownspace> SeanS: I dont know if larry is done with the ring or not
[14:45] #knownspace> Jim: Will Larry be joining us?
[14:45] #knownspace> SeanS: i emailed him and ed but have not gotten a reply
[14:45] flashNasty has joined #knownspace
[14:46] #knownspace> SeanS: ed said that he would not of made it on the first but today is doable.
[14:46] #knownspace> flashNasty: cool
[14:46] #knownspace> flashNasty: eris is still working :)
[14:46] #knownspace> Fred: and what of Lensman?
[14:46] #knownspace> SeanS: i sent him a reminder
[14:46] #knownspace> Fred: k
[14:47] #knownspace> nedry: i spoke to him on the phone the other day. i'm surpised he's not here.
[14:47] #knownspace> SeanS: i sent the chat notice to the list and then forwarded it to ed, larry, and sooby
[14:48] #knownspace> unclenasty: hey Sean - there's a dist-upgrade ready for brennan as well. we may want to consider that
[14:50] #knownspace> SeanS: i did an updat and upgrade at the start of the year and init 6'd it. its a different command to do the dist upgrade.
[14:50] #knownspace> unclenasty: yeah - apt-get dist-upgrade
[14:50] #knownspace> unclenasty: or aptitude
[14:51] #knownspace> SeanS: lets back the thing up tomorrow or so then we can to the big upgrade
[14:51] #knownspace> unclenasty: no worries
[14:53] #knownspace> SeanS: cant do it today anyway. ;)
[14:53] #knownspace> ericholtman: what could possibly go wrong?
[14:53] #knownspace> SeanS: the mind boggles
[14:53] #knownspace> unclenasty: <clarkson>how hard could it be?</clarkson>
[14:53] #knownspace> ericholtman: is brennan an actual machine somewhere, or a VPS?
[14:54] #knownspace> SeanS: its an actual machine
[14:54] #knownspace> SeanS: runs ubuntu server (no gui)
[14:55] #knownspace> nedry: last time i let an ubuntu box upgrade, it blew it sky high
[14:55] #knownspace> SeanS: thats why i want to back the thing up first ;)
[14:55] #knownspace> nedry: hehehehe
[14:56] #knownspace> SeanS: i remember your box detonating
[14:56] #knownspace> nedry: i'm having a run of bad luck lately, so don't let me do it.
[14:56] #knownspace> unclenasty: it's behaved itself well, to be honest
[14:56] #knownspace> nedry: although i did fix this pc
[14:56] #knownspace> ericholtman: yeah, I run a website for my wife's hobby forums, but I use linode.com for it. I love not having to worry about hardware, and love the almost-instant reloads of software you get running a para-virtualized server
[14:56] #knownspace> nedry: i think i had a bad dimm
[14:56] #knownspace> unclenasty: i've been looking at <hate>cloud sourcing</hate> a virtual machine for testing
[14:57] #knownspace> unclenasty: it looks promising
[14:57] #knownspace> Fred: I think you are a bit dimm
[14:57] #knownspace> Fred: :)
[14:57] #knownspace> nedry: heh...
[14:57] #knownspace> Fred: that would have been funnier if it had appeared directly below your text. Stupid interweb lag.
[14:58] #knownspace> unclenasty: the interwebs can be laggy
[14:58] #knownspace> ericholtman: i really like linode for that stuff, but if it's a test box you'll be turning on and off a lot, AWS might be a better choice.
[14:58] #knownspace> unclenasty: i think the tubes may be full
[14:58] #knownspace> nedry: my mac se died. sigh.
[14:58] #knownspace> unclenasty: :(
[14:58] #knownspace> nedry: time to maybe turn it into a fish tank
[14:58] #knownspace> Fred: I got a girl angry with me the other day
[14:58] #knownspace> nedry: i think it needs an analog board.
[14:58] #knownspace> Fred: quoted Barbarella "guess you're just not the tube type"
[14:59] #knownspace> Fred: her father thought it was hysterical
[14:59] #knownspace> Fred: she told me that that phrase is, among young people, (or at least her) a nasty crack saying you're too stupid to use the interweb
[14:59] #knownspace> Akiraa: cloud is mostly newspeak for hosting
[14:59] #knownspace> Fred: I consider that a radical interpretation of the text
[15:00] #knownspace> Fred: reminded me of Louis and Teela and her having never heard his jokes
[15:00] #knownspace> unclenasty: heh
[15:01] #knownspace> NickE: back
[15:01] #knownspace> Fred: I have to go to the Pharmacy of Doom
[15:02] #knownspace> Fred: and then Safeway
[15:02] #knownspace> ericholtman: date night?
[15:02] #knownspace> Fred: hope there's no political rallys
[15:03] #knownspace> SeanS: no kidding
[15:03] #knownspace> nedry: absolutely. stay away from those!
[15:03] #knownspace> nedry: off to store back 1/2 hour
[15:04] #knownspace> NickE: evenin' peeps
[15:04] #knownspace> SeanS: hi nick
[15:04] #knownspace> SeanS: i went to the beer store earlier
[15:05] #knownspace> NickE: on the vino tonight
[15:05] #knownspace> SeanS: no sunday sales here in bible belt land
[15:05] #knownspace> ericholtman: always hated that in CT.
[15:05] #knownspace> NickE: no such restrictions here
[15:05] #knownspace> SeanS: if i drank wine while typing in here you would see me type stuff like l;kekazpi3ena in no time
[15:05] #knownspace> unclenasty: i'd hate to live somewhere they'd refuse to sell yo ubeer due to the day of the week <shudder>
[15:06] #knownspace> NickE: I do that anywayssjk[
[15:06] #knownspace> Fred: don't most places have blue law sundays?
[15:06] #knownspace> Fred: we still do, although it's a very short span of time now
[15:06] #knownspace> NickE: wtf is blue law?
[15:06] #knownspace> Fred: blue law is no sale of liquor
[15:06] #knownspace> NickE: ah
[15:06] #knownspace> Fred: no idea why it's called that
[15:06] #knownspace> NickE: odd reference
[15:06] #knownspace> SeanS: i think lexington and louisville will sell package stuff on sunday but not here in frankfort
[15:07] #knownspace> Jim: Fred, do you know what happended in AZ with that congresswoman?
[15:07] #knownspace> SeanS: from the blue haired church goers who push for no sunday sales
[15:07] #knownspace> Fred: I think ours is now from like 2am to 10am sunday morning
[15:07] #knownspace> NickE: heh
[15:07] #knownspace> Akiraa: US alcohol regulations are intriguing
[15:07] #knownspace> Fred: nobody knows much of anything sean
[15:08] #knownspace> unclenasty: " the generic term "blue law" that refers to any laws regulating activities on Sunday"
[15:08] #knownspace> Fred: congresswoman, at least 5 others, shot at rally outside Safeway supermarket, congresswoman taken to hospital
[15:08] #knownspace> NickE: Switzerland has some odd ones - I recall when travelling 22 years ago
[15:08] #knownspace> Fred: suspect in custody
[15:08] #knownspace> Fred: that's it. everything else is reporters just making crap up
[15:09] #knownspace> NickE: Like the off licenec (liquor store) was open every second Thursday between 2 and 4.0pm. Bizaare
[15:09] #knownspace> NickE: blimey
[15:10] #knownspace> NickE: might feel like shooting our politicians sometimes but we rarely do
[15:11] #knownspace> NickE: not nice
[15:11] #knownspace> Fred: hey, we repealed our blue law a few months ago!
[15:12] Larry has joined #knownspace
[15:12] #knownspace> unclenasty: just reading the latest in the wakefield/mmr vaccine story
[15:12] #knownspace> unclenasty: what a travesty
[15:12] #knownspace> SeanS: Hi Larry
[15:13] #knownspace> Fred: Hey, Larry!
[15:13] #knownspace> NickE: Hi Larry
[15:13] #knownspace> unclenasty: Hi Larry
[15:13] #knownspace> Larry: Hi, guys.
[15:13] #knownspace> SeanS: Akirra, now ask your question ;)
[15:13] #knownspace> Larry: If discussion is of Betrayer, I'll lurk for a bit.
[15:13] #knownspace> unclenasty: lol
[15:14] #knownspace> Fred: hee hee
[15:14] #knownspace> SeanS: havent started on betrayer thus far
[15:14] #knownspace> NickE: Me either
[15:14] #knownspace> unclenasty: not read it yet, despite many un-subtle hints to me darling wife
[15:14] #knownspace> Fred: Akiraa has a Betrayer question, but it's just about reading order, not content
[15:14] #knownspace> NickE: was waiting to get it for Christmas and it didn't materialise :-)
[15:14] #knownspace> unclenasty: what NickE said...
[15:14] #knownspace> Fred: Hey, I got BEST OF LARRY NIVEN for my birthday yesterday!
[15:15] #knownspace> Fred: er, day before
[15:15] #knownspace> NickE: Lucky bugger#
[15:15] #knownspace> NickE: Happy BD Fred
[15:15] #knownspace> unclenasty: happy two-days-after-your-birthday, Fred
[15:15] #knownspace> Fred: I hadn't read SMUT TALK
[15:15] #knownspace> Fred: thanks!
[15:15] #knownspace> unclenasty: i liked smut talk
[15:15] #knownspace> NickE: Oh yes, thats a good DT story
[15:16] #knownspace> Fred: but what did you think of the story?
[15:16] #knownspace> Larry: I've got 30 copies of BEST OF. I think 24 are to be signed and sent on to Mysterious Galaxy. Will check.
[15:16] #knownspace> SeanS: brb, have to order gf a pizza..... most likely will have to be delivered by snowplow
[15:18] #knownspace> Akiraa: Larry, what are the reading prerequisite for "Betrayer of Worlds"?
[15:18] #knownspace> NickE: the other 3 Worlds books I imagine :-)
[15:18] #knownspace> Fred: Tell Larry what you've read so far, Akiraa. Yes on Ringworld, No on any other Fleet of Worlds books, right?
[15:19] #knownspace> unclenasty: oops
[15:19] #knownspace> Akiraa: And are you planning to return to the Ringworld arc some time in the future?
[15:20] #knownspace> Larry: It's true: the Fleet of Worlds books form a sequence, and it helps if you've read other Known Space stories.
[15:20] Outsider has joined #knownspace
[15:20] #knownspace> NickE: wb
[15:20] #knownspace> unclenasty: i'm modifying the biblio module
[15:20] #knownspace> unclenasty: ahh
[15:20] #knownspace> unclenasty: I'm breaking the biblio module
[15:24] Outsider has joined #knownspace
[15:24] #knownspace> Jim: hello?
[15:24] #knownspace> Fred: hello
[15:24] #knownspace> unclenasty: ?olleh
[15:25] #knownspace> NickE: hi Jim
[15:25] #knownspace> Fred: 43110
[15:25] Outsider has joined #knownspace
[15:26] #knownspace> Jim: Larry, are you planning to write any Ringworld-series novels after Ringworld's Children?
[15:27] Outsider has joined #knownspace
[15:29] #knownspace> unclenasty: ok I think I got him fixed
[15:29] #knownspace> Larry: THE FATE OF WORLDS follows RINGWORLD'S CHILDREN, but you won't see the Ringworld again except in flashback. And that's it, I swear.
[15:29] #knownspace> Jim: .Outsider status
[15:29] #knownspace> Jim: Fantastic
[15:29] #knownspace> NickE: oh interesting
[15:30] #knownspace> NickE: so the series will bracket the entire Ringworld sequence?
[15:30] #knownspace> unclenasty: the thing is you couldn't bring back a protector with that level of nanotech at his disposal... it'd be almost impossible to come up with a situation where it could be beat or need assistance...
[15:32] #knownspace> Larry: NickE: yeah.
[15:33] #knownspace> NickE: nice
[15:33] #knownspace> Larry: Unclenasty: Yeah, exactly. it would be worse for writing than the (maybe) Teela gene.
[15:33] #knownspace> NickE: heh
[15:35] Lensman_Free has joined #knownspace
[15:35] #knownspace> NickE: hi Lens
[15:35] #knownspace> Lensman_Free: Hi Nick
[15:36] #knownspace> Lensman_Free: Can't stay, have Laser Rangers today.
[15:36] #knownspace> Lensman_Free: I mean, can't stay long.
[15:36] #knownspace> SeanS: we will be back on regular schedule next month
[15:36] #knownspace> Larry: I'm on record as to the difficulty of writing of a superintelligent character.
[15:37] #knownspace> Lensman_Free: Larry: I'm not trying to be flattering when I say, you do it better than anyone else I have read. Comparing the way you write protectors to others trying to do that... it's embarrassing.
[15:37] #knownspace> NickE: hardly surprising, I'd be stumped where to start
[15:38] #knownspace> NickE: I'd go with that
[15:38] #knownspace> Jim: I suppose that the author could give the super-intelligent character a problem like String Theory to solve.
[15:38] #knownspace> Lensman_Free: Some of the MKW stories have troglodyte protectors acting like Motie warriors! Hardly super-intelligent protectors.
[15:38] #knownspace> unclenasty: how did you & Ed copy with writing for ol't'ro must have been tricky. I'd guess you have to just make any decision by that character based on days or more of thinking and discussion so you can hammer out all the points that make a snap choice the right one
[15:39] #knownspace> Lensman_Free: Dumb as a brick, less able with tactics than a Marine fresh out of boot camp.
[15:39] #knownspace> unclenasty: s/copy/cope
[15:42] #knownspace> Lensman: And in DESTROYER OF WORLDS T-fok escapes FIVE TIMES before finally making his getaway! I rather think P-pok would have managed it the first time. I guess we have to put that down to T-fok being young, inexperienced, and relatively naive.
[15:42] #knownspace> Larry: Yeah, the author's advantage is he's got time to think. Disadvantage: he can't make a mistake.
[15:43] #knownspace> Larry: But give a protector a supertool, and you get no story.
[15:45] #knownspace> NickE: quite. It's all a bit of balancing act I guess
[15:46] #knownspace> unclenasty: has anyone read the wellworld books?
[15:46] #knownspace> SeanS: i have
[15:46] #knownspace> Lensman: Yah, a long time ago. Only remember them vaguely.
[15:47] #knownspace> Lensman: Magic level tech. Highly artificial world.
[15:48] #knownspace> unclenasty: i think they made that mistake... you have these equations that let you warp reality. Once you have the math, you can do anything, so no more story
[15:48] #knownspace> SeanS: i think the best scene i can remember is a ship moving out of a low tech hex to a high tech hex, uncovering the laser cannon and firing at their pursuer still in the low tech hex . water vessels
[15:48] #knownspace> Larry: I read the first Wellworld book.
[15:49] #knownspace> Lensman: Or if there is a story, it's like the Iliad or the Odyssey. The mortals can strain and strive for all they are worth, and then a god renders it all pointless with a wave of his hand.
[15:49] #knownspace> Larry: Should I have continued? I admired the author. He bloody well finished his trilogies.
[15:49] #knownspace> unclenasty: pretty much
[15:49] #knownspace> SeanS: was that jack chalker?
[15:49] #knownspace> unclenasty: and then chalker wrote more books in the series without adding anything to it
[15:50] #knownspace> Lensman: Jack Chalker, yes.
[15:50] #knownspace> SeanS: he also did dancing gods i think
[15:50] #knownspace> Fred: Sooby Dooby Doooo!
[15:50] #knownspace> Lensman: Yah, Larry, have to agree with uncle. Reading more books in the series didn't really add anything.
[15:51] #knownspace> Lensman: That's "Scooby", Fred.
[15:54] #knownspace> unclenasty: I know the answer was 'no' last time I asked, but has anyone attempted John Clute's "Appleseed" yet?
[15:55] #knownspace> Lensman: Well World seemed highly contrived to me. The tech could change your body to anything you could imagine, but you couldn't change someone's mind permanently... you couldn't change someone's brain to be your devoted slave permanently. They would be your slave only under direct influence of the machine, and only while it was turned on. If turned off, they instantly regained their free will and...
[15:55] #knownspace> Lensman: ...former attitudes.
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[15:55] #knownspace> EML: Afternoon, all.
[15:55] #knownspace> Fred: EML
[15:55] #knownspace> unclenasty: hi Ed
[15:55] #knownspace> Lensman: Welcome Ed!
[15:55] #knownspace> Larry: Matthew Harrington is a guy who writes entertainingly of protectors. (Man-Kzin Wars.) I gave him a half-written story to finish, and it's waiting for me.
[15:55] #knownspace> nedry: "Why do we take our cues from some dork in a neckerchief?"
[15:55] #knownspace> nedry: hi ed!
[15:55] #knownspace> NickE: hi Ed
[15:55] #knownspace> Jim: A dipole solution: Larry and EML at the same chat and at the same time.
[15:56] #knownspace> SeanS: its happened before and the earth did not spin off its axis
[15:56] #knownspace> Fred: not that you know of
[15:56] #knownspace> Lensman: Nor even reverse and start rotating from west to east.
[15:56] #knownspace> SeanS: well, true
[15:56] #knownspace> unclenasty: <wayne's world>We are not worthy!, etc</wayne's world>

[15:57] #knownspace> EML: so have you asked Larry a thousand questions about Betrayer?
[15:57] #knownspace> Fred: remember, in the first draft of THE CORE, the earth stopped spinning but only the astronauts in the shuttle in space noticed
[15:57] #knownspace> Fred: No, Ed
[15:57] #knownspace> SeanS: surprisingly no
[15:57] #knownspace> nedry: but if the earth stops spinning, fred, your teacher said you'd float away!
[15:57] #knownspace> Lensman: I dunno, I just got here myself.
[15:57] #knownspace> Jim: Larry, have you heard that the North Magnetic Pole is moving towards Russia at a rate of 40 miles/year?
[15:57] #knownspace> Fred: Larry threatened to lurk if we did :)
[15:58] #knownspace> Jim: Draco Tavern will become realistic.
[15:58] #knownspace> EML: Well if you've been holding onto your questions ... have at it.
[15:58] #knownspace> Fred: the only Betrayer question was from Akiraa: does he need to read the other FOW books first? (He's read Ringworld)
[15:59] #knownspace> Larry: Hello, Ed. Few questions re BETRAYER. I take that as a good sign.
[15:59] #knownspace> Larry: A book that needs explaining would need rewriting. A book should speak for itself.
[15:59] #knownspace> EML: Hi Larry. Yes, I can see that.
[16:00] #knownspace> Akiraa: I was wondering if Larry or an associate Known Space writer would be interested in continuing the Ringworld arc
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[16:00] #knownspace> EML: Akiraa: we strive to have the books stand alone.
[16:00] #knownspace> Fred: hey Ronn
[16:00] #knownspace> ronn: Hello!
[16:00] #knownspace> NickE: hi Ronn
[16:00] #knownspace> Jim: Ronn
[16:01] #knownspace> EML: Fate of Worlds will be as much sequel to Ringworld's Children as to Betrayer of Worlds.
[16:01] #knownspace> SeanS: thats what Larry mentioned earlier.
[16:01] #knownspace> Akiraa: ah, so there is a sequel in the works :)
[16:02] #knownspace> Lensman: I note a number of clues in the OF WORLDs books that point to events in FATE, but there's no point in asking about them... Ed and Larry, quite properly, don't do spoilers, nor would I want them to.
[16:03] #knownspace> EML: And back to when to read Betrayer ... there's no need to have read Ringworld, either. Betrayer takes place 70 years before Ringworld.
[16:03] #knownspace> unclenasty: it would help to have read the events in "Crashlander"
[16:03] #knownspace> Lensman: But I do note that the movement of the Fleet of Worlds as described in the OF WORLD books... very slowly accelerating over the decades... cannot possibly be reconciled with the position as described in Rw, so I'll be very interested to see how that apparent discrepancy is resolved in FATE. Apparently the Fleet goes FTL at some point?
[16:04] #knownspace> Jim: I think that it would be wise to have some familiarity with the character of Louis Wu before reading Betrayer, strictly IMHO.
[16:04] #knownspace> EML: undernasty: yours is a common opinion among people who have read the Shaeffer stories. I find that people with no knowledge of the earlier stories do fine.
[16:05] #knownspace> unclenasty: I was thinking having some character background on Sigmund would help, but with the memory 'trouble' he has I agree it's not essential
[16:06] #knownspace> Lensman: The Siggy who appears in "Neutron Star" and "The Borderland of Sol" is a very different character than the one who appears in JUGGLER OF WORLDS and sequels. I don't think it helps at all to have read the earlier ones.
[16:08] #knownspace> EML: OTOH, the Sigmund seen in the early stories was never a point of view character.
[16:10] #knownspace> EML: But I'll let Sigmund speak for himself henceforth :-)
[16:10] #knownspace> Lensman: Siggy in "Borderland", as in "Neutron Star", is a bit buffoonish. In "Borderland" he is obsessed with gadgets, loads down Bey and Carlos like as movie James Bond with them, and from Bey's POV is a typical helpless Flatlander. That's about as far from the paranoid Siggy as one can get! I can see the argument that Siggy was good at fooling Bey by playing the fool, but the bit about relying on...
[16:10] #knownspace> Lensman: ...gadgets and being convinced they would save him... that just doesn't fit the OF WORLDS Siggy at all.
[16:10] #knownspace> SeanS: it was very enjoyable to me to se the Bey stories from Sig's point of view
[16:12] #knownspace> unclenasty: unless the Sigmund Buffoon was a front to throw off Carlos & Bey, and you have to admit, one of the gadgets came in handy at the end...
[16:12] #knownspace> SeanS: so i would recommend reading crashlander before of worlds but that is just personal experience
[16:12] #knownspace> Lensman: Yes, fortunately for Bey!
[16:14] #knownspace> EML: I'd kind of expected there to be questions about the Gw'oth.
[16:14] #knownspace> Lensman: I will still recommend NEUTRON STAR as the proper introduction to Known Space. CRASHLANDER contains only Beowulf Shaeffer stories, which are certainly some of the very best stories, but then so is "The Soft Weapon", which CRASHLANDER doesn't have. And in general, NEUTRON STAR gives a much better overview of Known Space. Seeing everything thru Bey's eyes is a bit limiting.
[16:15] #knownspace> Akiraa: Lensman, is that the author of the namesake series?
[16:15] #knownspace> SeanS: i would agree with neutron star before crashlander
[16:16] #knownspace> Lensman: Akiraa: What? Which series?
[16:16] #knownspace> Akiraa: Lensman (Triplanetary)
[16:17] #knownspace> Akiraa: by Doc Smith
[16:17] #knownspace> SeanS: e e doc smith wrote the lensman series
[16:17] #knownspace> Lensman: My screen name "Lensman" is a reference to the Lensman Series by "Doc" Smith, yes.
[16:17] #knownspace> SeanS: and skylark of space which i considered somewhat of a rehash and could not get through
[16:17] #knownspace> Lensman: Also intended as an ironic commentary on me thinking I'm a mental superman. :)
[16:18] #knownspace> Lensman: In the fashion of "Fans are Slans", if you're familiar with that fannish saying. Originally meant to be taken literally, but in fandom it quickly came to be used sarcastically.
[16:19] #knownspace> unclenasty: EML, I can't - I have yet to read Destroyer, despite numerous less-than-subtle hints to my significant other prior to xmas
[16:19] #knownspace> SeanS: neil, you can NOT borrow my copy... ;)
[16:19] #knownspace> unclenasty: ;-)
[16:19] #knownspace> Lensman: "Skylark" was written before "Lensman", except the final volume "Skylark DuQuesne", which was written late in Smith's life.
[16:20] #knownspace> unclenasty: betrayer, sorry, not destroyer
[16:20] #knownspace> unclenasty: i should be paying attention to chat and not trying to fix Outsider
[16:20] #knownspace> EML: undernasty: well tsk on her ;-)
[16:21] #knownspace> SeanS: my cousin had them all and loaned them to me... after reading the 6? lensman books, i only made it about halfway through the first skylark
[16:21] #knownspace> Lensman: Ed: I do enjoy the Gw'oth protagonist in the OF WORLDS books, but I confess it doesn't leave me wanting to know more about the species.
[16:22] #knownspace> SeanS: interesting to see the name ol't'ro chose, a direct tie in to ringworld
[16:22] #knownspace> Lensman: Skylark is a less rigorous effort at a galaxy-spanning space opera. But it is credited with being the first... with opening up the whole galaxy to space opera, instead of just the immediate neighborhood of Sol System.
[16:23] #knownspace> EML: So I was reading the March issue of Analog (yes, time travel), and I see Larry and I both have a story in the next issue. Just FYI.
[16:23] #knownspace> SeanS: trying not to spoil toooo much
[16:23] #knownspace> EML: SeanS: and I;m sure poeple appreciate that.
[16:23] #knownspace> Lensman: Skylark simply ignores the Einsteinian limits of lightspeed travel. Lensman is IMHO more rigorous, better thought out. But then Lensman was conceived from the start as a series... or as a long novel broken into book-sized chunks.
[16:25] #knownspace> Lensman: Okay, Sean, I'll bite: How is "ol-t-ro" a reference to RINGWORLD?
[16:25] #knownspace> SeanS: hmm, if skylark was written first, isnt that before their was an einsteinian limit
[16:25] #knownspace> SeanS: not the name ol't'ro... the name they chose to be known as
[16:26] #knownspace> Lensman: Einstein is specifically mentioned in THE SKYLARK OF SPACE. At least the edition I've read.
[16:26] #knownspace> SeanS: .g skylark
[16:26] #knownspace> SeanS: oh, outsider is down
[16:26] #knownspace> unclenasty: sorry
[16:26] #knownspace> unclenasty: gimme a min
[16:26] #knownspace> SeanS: no worries
[16:27] #knownspace> unclenasty: i know, I know, saturday chat is not when to decide to upgrade the channel bot
[16:27] #knownspace> unclenasty: i thought it would be a quick fix
[16:27] #knownspace> EML: Special relativity was puiblished in 1905. More than a century old ... hard for me to fathom.
[16:27] #knownspace> SeanS: i didnt realize it was that early
[16:28] #knownspace> Jim: It is hard to imagine a universe without relativity.
[16:29] #knownspace> Lensman: Special Relativity dates to 1905, not sure when it gained wide acceptance. SKYLARK was serialized starting in 1929, as I recall.
[16:29] #knownspace> EML: I think the universe knew before we mere humans did :-)
[16:29] #knownspace> Akiraa: it is hard to stick to pure relativistic travel, because it's one-way
[16:30] #knownspace> Akiraa: but even relativistic travel requires some ridiculous amount of shiending
[16:30] #knownspace> Lensman: The game background for SPACE:1889 is quite interesting. Ether is very real and has consequences for space travel. Newton rules!
[16:30] #knownspace> Akiraa: plain protons become ultra high energy cosmic rays
[16:30] #knownspace> Jim: During and before WWII, there were some German physicists who called Relativity the Jewish Physics.
[16:31] #knownspace> SeanS: i thought relativity was done in the early 30's my mistake.
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[16:32] #knownspace> Lensman: IIRC it gained wide acceptance after the observations during a solar eclipse. But I don't remember what year. Einstein correctly predicted the bending of light rays from stars near the sun, which could only be observed during a total eclipse and even then the observations were very difficult. The first time they tried, they failed.
[16:32] #knownspace> SeanS: hi outsider
[16:32] #knownspace> Outsider: Hola SeanS:)
[16:33] #knownspace> Akiraa: general relativity requires some heavy math to comprehend and it took a few years after Einstein for that to happen, IIRC
[16:33] #knownspace> SeanS: yes, lensman, i saw a special on those tests a couple of weeks ago
[16:33] #knownspace> Jim: Lensman, those observations were made shortly after WWI.
[16:33] #knownspace> Lensman: Special Relativity came before General Relativity.
[16:33] #knownspace> EML: The light bending proof ... isn't that for general relativity?
[16:34] #knownspace> Jim: I am still waiting for Blaine to teach me the math behind GR.
[16:34] #knownspace> Lensman: Maybe so, Ed. I'm not up on the difference between Special and General Relativity.
[16:34] #knownspace> Akiraa: special relativity = easy, general relativity = hyperbolic geometry
[16:34] #knownspace> Jim: pee break
[16:35] #knownspace> Lensman: Special Relativity does not consider accelerating frames of reference, General does. That's all I know about the difference.
[16:35] #knownspace> Akiraa: blaine would just pit two physicists against each other like he did in that chess game
[16:36] #knownspace> EML: General relativity also deals with the geometry of space-time; gravity beomces a property of the curvature of S-T.
[16:37] #knownspace> Lensman: But the inertialess drive in the Lensman series was very clever. It let Smith sidestep the lightspeed limit without breaking any laws of physics. It has often been praised as being one of the few FTL travel methods that can't be disproved. And Smith was very, very thorough in thinking thru the consequences of inertialessness. It's essentially a fantasy vehicle, but Smith took a "hard-SF"...
[16:37] #knownspace> Lensman: ...approach to the structure, the assumptions, he build on top of that fantasy premise.
[16:37] #knownspace> Jim: back
[16:38] #knownspace> Lensman: Altho Larry has a very different take on reducing inertia in "ARM" !
[16:38] #knownspace> Jim: .g ARM
[16:38] #knownspace> Jim: rats
[16:39] #knownspace> unclenasty: almost
[16:39] #knownspace> Lensman: mice
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[16:40] #knownspace> Larry: I used reduced intertia. That wouldn't have helped Smith with relativity.
[16:40] #knownspace> Lensman: Well, I'm surprised there are no questions about BOW.
[16:41] #knownspace> Akiraa: I was gifted Michio Kaku's "Parallel Worlds" this x-mas -- is it worth a read?
[16:41] #knownspace> EML: If there aren't, there aren't.
[16:41] #knownspace> ronn: Some of us haven't been able to read BoW yet.
[16:41] #knownspace> Larry: Michio Kaku is generally worth reading.
[16:41] #knownspace> Lensman: Mine mostly would have to do with the discrepancies between BOW and Rw. Not sure there's much point into going into those. Seems like nit-picking, which isn't fun for the authors.
[16:42] #knownspace> Akiraa: if only there were a way to auto-create a fully consistent universe
[16:42] #knownspace> Jim: I read BOW, but I have no questions.
[16:42] #knownspace> Akiraa: like a cellular automaton
[16:43] #knownspace> SeanS: I started reading it and then took a break halfway through to read The Pacific which my dad gave me. finished BOW this morning and would like to read it again and uninterupted so I have a better feel for it.
[16:44] #knownspace> Lensman: But here's a possibly snarky question: At no point does any KS story say "The Louis Wu of RINGWORLD and 'There Is a Tide' is the same Louis Wu who is the son of Carlos Wu and Sharrol Janss." So, is the Nathan/Louis of BOW the same Louis of RINGWORLD? Certainly there are some pretty strong indications in Rw that they are not the same guy!
[16:44] #knownspace> ronn: There is . . . but it takes several billion years to get results . . .
[16:46] #knownspace> EML: Lens: I don't see how, after BOW, there is any ambiguity. What am I missing?
[16:48] #knownspace> Jim: EML: I agree
[16:48] #knownspace> Lensman: "The foreign stars didn't bother him. City lights drowned the starlight over most of the Earth; and Louis Wu had been raised a flatlander. He had not seen a star until he was twenty-six." --RINGWORLD chapter 5
[16:49] #knownspace> EML: By the time of RW, Louis has had (excuse me for being vague, for the benefit of others) things happen to him.
[16:50] #knownspace> SeanS: I take the view that Known Space has to be like VGER.. it is over 40 years old and must evolve. ;)
[16:51] #knownspace> EML: 17 billion kilometers and counting ...
[16:52] #knownspace> Akiraa: 17 billion km is barely 12au or so
[16:52] #knownspace> Akiraa: pardon, 113 au :)
[16:52] #knownspace> SeanS: mathlete
[16:53] #knownspace> Akiraa: definitely smaller than the milky way + magellanic clouds
[16:55] #knownspace> Lensman: Also, the Louis Wu of RINGWORLD clearly has watched Earth become homogenized over the centuries, seen the cities blend together... he has see it happen. The Louis of BOW did not even get to earth until shortly before his, I think it was his 130th birthday?
[16:56] #knownspace> Lensman: The Louis of BOW was not raised a Flatlander, he was raised on Home, and he must have seen stars many times.
[16:56] #knownspace> EML: Lens: I'm afraid of giving out a spoiler. Answer to you by private email ...
[16:56] #knownspace> SeanS: not homogenized, he sees fashions change in a single world wide surge... he was complaining about it basically being one city spread over the globe connected by instantaeneous transport
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[16:57] #knownspace> Larry: I should get back to work. Fare you all well.
[16:57] #knownspace> SeanS: Wu himself is a product of the homogenenization
[16:57] #knownspace> Fred: thanks for stopping by Lary
[16:57] #knownspace> Fred: Larry
[16:58] #knownspace> Jim: bye Larry
[16:58] #knownspace> AlexA: Bad timing! :(
[16:58] #knownspace> SeanS: no shit
[16:59] #knownspace> Lensman: "But the blending of the cities was real. Louis had watched it happen." --RINGWORLD ch. 1
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[16:59] #knownspace> Fred: Lensy, this is why I said BoW is like Enterprise
[16:59] #knownspace> EML: THINKS he watched it happen.
[16:59] #knownspace> Fred: right
[16:59] #knownspace> AlexA: So any big LN relevations I missed?
[16:59] #knownspace> Fred: it's a retcon that requires a mind wipe to exist
[17:00] #knownspace> SeanS: true ed. memories have been altered in knowspace from the time of the brennan-monster
[17:00] #knownspace> Fred: We can't trust anything Louis remembers now
[17:00] #knownspace> vilstef: Hi all
[17:00] #knownspace> SeanS: hi vilstef
[17:00] #knownspace> Jim: a complete mind wipe; Louis Wu no longer remembers his parents
[17:00] #knownspace> Fred: vilstef
[17:01] #knownspace> vilstef: Hi Fred
[17:01] #knownspace> Fred: Unless, like Enterprise, BoW turns out to be a holodeck fantasy :)
[17:01] #knownspace> SeanS: god that episode sucked
[17:01] #knownspace> Fred: sucked = "best of series"
[17:01] #knownspace> EML: Nessus doesn't do complete wipes ... he's more subtle. Consider how selectively he edited Sigmund's memories. Anything less woudl have made Sigmund useless to Nessus.
[17:01] #knownspace> Lensman: And the Louis of Rw is rich enough to have his own singleship, in which he takes a sabbatical every 40 years. The Louis of BOW is desperately poor, clearly not rich enough to own a starship, or even rent one for any extended period of time.
[17:01] #knownspace> AlexA: Hmm I'm only upto JoW. Should I quit to avoid spoilers?
[17:02] #knownspace> Fred: not yet alexa
[17:02] #knownspace> AlexA: Cheers Fred
[17:03] #knownspace> EML: *I* won't give any spoilers. (And anyway, I, too, am going to toddle off soon.)
[17:03] #knownspace> AlexA: Any news on Anvil or whatever it's called now?
[17:03] #knownspace> EML: Tongs?
[17:03] #knownspace> Lensman: Yah, I will be having visitors shortly, so I need to go myself.
[17:03] #knownspace> SeanS: no, the 2 episode mirror thingy was best in series
[17:03] #knownspace> Lensman: Tail high, brothers!
[17:04] #knownspace> Jim: bye Lensman
[17:04] #knownspace> Fred: Sean, part 1 was good, part 2 was horrid
[17:04] #knownspace> AlexA: I got £50 book token for Xmas so should be able to catch up with latest LN
[17:04] #knownspace> Fred: with that poser level Gorn
[17:04] #knownspace> Fred: cool alexa
[17:04] #knownspace> SeanS: i guess i just always liked the mirror universe
[17:05] #knownspace> Fred: me too
[17:05] #knownspace> EML: That's it for me. Bye, all.
[17:05] #knownspace> Fred: although I'd have preferred it if archer were the CAUSE of teh mirror universe breakoff
[17:05] unclenasty has joined #knownspace
[17:05] #knownspace> AlexA: Bye eml
[17:05] #knownspace> SeanS: later ed
[17:05] #knownspace> Fred: bye ed
[17:06] #knownspace> SeanS: enterprise had such potential and just sucked as a series
[17:07] #knownspace> Fred: two words: brannon braga
[17:07] #knownspace> SeanS: i know... i typically call them beavis and butthead
[17:07] #knownspace> vilstef: that works
[17:08] #knownspace> AlexA: Aparently Dichen Lachan <sp> has joined Torchwood S4
[17:08] #knownspace> Jim: Brannon Braga has no business writing television, much less Sci-FI television.
[17:08] #knownspace> Fred: all of Enterprise's multi part stories collapsed in the last patr
[17:08] #knownspace> Fred: Alexa, I tweet with Dichen
[17:08] #knownspace> AlexA: She was Sierra/Priya in Dollhouse
[17:08] #knownspace> Fred: She's apparently just in the pilot
[17:09] #knownspace> AlexA: What's your Twitter ID Fred ?
[17:09] #knownspace> Fred: lol, I have no idea
[17:09] #knownspace> Fred: let me look :)
[17:09] #knownspace> Jim: Twitter is for twits.
[17:09] #knownspace> Fred: anim8rFSK
[17:10] #knownspace> vilstef: I'm into anti-social networking myself:)
[17:10] #knownspace> Lensman-Free: Oh, here's a final thought: If we must assume that the two Louises are one and the same and that one Louis had his memories altered, then I choose to believe it was the Nathan/Louis of BOW who had his memories altered... not the Louis of RINGWORLD!
[17:10] #knownspace> AlexA: I'll follow :) I'm Rednax42
[17:10] #knownspace> Fred: roger that
[17:11] #knownspace> SeanS: yeah, i added you in skype Fred... reckon you dont run it that often
[17:11] #knownspace> AlexA: Well Twitter can be informative - depends who you follow
[17:11] #knownspace> SeanS: same nick
[17:11] #knownspace> Fred: pretty much 'never' on skype
[17:11] #knownspace> AlexA: It's certainly quick for breaking news
[17:11] #knownspace> Akiraa: is that anti-social networking or anti social-networking?
[17:11] #knownspace> SeanS: i am on facebook and that is as social as i am going to get
[17:12] #knownspace> AlexA: Assume you all heard of the Az Rep Giffords shooting :(
[17:12] #knownspace> Fred: You're on Facebook, Sean?
[17:12] #knownspace> Fred: :D
[17:13] #knownspace> SeanS: I skype so when I am freezing to death up here, Euan can video chat me from a party and have women in (and sometimes not in) bikinis walk by in the background
[17:13] #knownspace> vilstef: It can be both
[17:13] #knownspace> AlexA: I have a DB account but it's basically blank
[17:13] #knownspace> AlexA: FB^
[17:13] #knownspace> Fred: http://twitter.com/#!/Dichenlachman
[17:13] #knownspace> ronn: Yes . . . we've heard various contradictory things. Any _confirmed_ news to share?
[17:13] #knownspace> Fred: none
[17:13] #knownspace> Akiraa: "As a programmer you must take great care of your brain it is your primary asset after all. You must feed it carefully with caffeine and chocolate and regularly cleanse it with alcohol."
[17:14] #knownspace> SeanS: good plan Akiraa
[17:14] #knownspace> AlexA: I already follow Dichen
[17:14] #knownspace> vilstef: NY Times and BBC have basically what I've read on the list email about the shootings.
[17:15] Outsider has joined #knownspace
[17:15] #knownspace> vilstef: One of those was saying 17 shot!
[17:15] #knownspace> Fred: But do you own the DVD of Aztek Rex? :)
[17:15] #knownspace> AlexA: When I left Twitter to come here. A 9yo was dead & giffords out of surgery
[17:15] #knownspace> Fred: Wiki is saying 19 shot
[17:16] #knownspace> Fred: the numbers are spiralling out of control
[17:16] #knownspace> SeanS: i am not going to think of even looking until the morning
[17:16] #knownspace> SeanS: couple of words transposed there
[17:16] #knownspace> Akiraa: how tough is arizona's gun control?
[17:16] #knownspace> Fred: LOL
[17:16] #knownspace> Fred: gun control?
[17:16] #knownspace> SeanS: i am not even going to think of looking until the morning.
[17:16] #knownspace> vilstef: Must've been a concentrated crowd for that many wounded.
[17:16] #knownspace> SeanS: gun control is hitting your target
[17:16] #knownspace> Fred: Besides, Tucson is on the Mexican border
[17:17] #knownspace> Fred: wild wild west
[17:17] #knownspace> Akiraa: well, invariably these shootings end up stirring anti-gun people into action
[17:17] #knownspace> AlexA: I'll resist the temptation to speculate or comment on US gun law
[17:18] #knownspace> unclenasty: OK outsider is back
[17:18] #knownspace> unclenasty: hi Outsider
[17:18] #knownspace> Outsider: Hello unclenasty!
[17:18] #knownspace> Fred: vilstef, yeah, to shoot 19 people, you'd have to reload, or hit multiple targets with each shot, or have a semi auto with a drum or something
[17:18] #knownspace> SeanS: i cant believe you messed with the bot all that time when you can do so at meetings that you hate
[17:18] #knownspace> unclenasty: i know
[17:19] #knownspace> vilstef: New Hampshire has okd unconcealed weapons on their Capitol grounds and building
[17:19] #knownspace> AlexA: Some assault rifles have 30 round mags
[17:19] #knownspace> unclenasty: i just though i'd make a quick tweak and then I ran into a holy-shit-i-broke-it error
[17:19] #knownspace> SeanS: my beretta hold a max of 16 rounds with current equipment
[17:19] #knownspace> AlexA: He could have had 2 weapons
[17:19] #knownspace> Akiraa: 19 people, that's more than a couple of clips
[17:19] #knownspace> AlexA: Oops, Im speculating...
[17:20] #knownspace> Akiraa: so I assume nobody was armed except the killer
[17:20] #knownspace> ronn: Akiraa: Not pre-1994.
[17:20] #knownspace> SeanS: my beretta is 9mm. it COULD kill with each shot but I would have to be Clint Eastwood in a movie to think that I could pull that off
[17:20] #knownspace> AlexA: Watched "Moon" for first time recently
[17:21] #knownspace> unclenasty: what did you think AlexA ?
[17:21] #knownspace> AlexA: Plot was a bit predictable. But liked the model work
[17:21] #knownspace> unclenasty: i thought for the budget it did an amazing job
[17:22] #knownspace> unclenasty: and I loved the blend of models & computer work
[17:22] #knownspace> AlexA: Reminded me a lot of "Silent Running"
[17:22] #knownspace> AlexA: Was there much cgi?
[17:22] #knownspace> vilstef: I haven't seen it. I hope the people in it were brighter than Bruce Dern.
[17:24] #knownspace> unclenasty: the displays and some of the gerti stuff, as well as some volumetric and particle anims for the exterior shots
[17:24] #knownspace> AlexA: I think one of the characters get's a bit Dern-ish at one point
[17:24] #knownspace> unclenasty: also for stitching the sam scenes
[17:24] #knownspace> AlexA: Right
[17:25] #knownspace> unclenasty: i liked the atmosphere, or lack thereof
[17:25] #knownspace> SeanS: I have moon but have not watched it
[17:25] #knownspace> unclenasty: and the wide shots showing the area the harvesters had covered
[17:25] #knownspace> AlexA: Certainly a great acting job from Rockwell
[17:26] #knownspace> NickE: well that killled the convo
[17:26] NickE has joined #knownspace
[17:26] #knownspace> AlexA: Plot didn't grab me
[17:26] #knownspace> SeanS: thats the one where the guy is alone on the darkside for years mining?
[17:27] #knownspace> NickE: hm. eri didn't give a disconect warning so I just thought stuff had stalled
[17:27] #knownspace> unclenasty: yeah
[17:27] #knownspace> SeanS: or am i completely off
[17:27] #knownspace> unclenasty: wb nick
[17:27] #knownspace> Jim: darkside or farside?
[17:27] #knownspace> AlexA: Yes SeanS
[17:27] #knownspace> NickE: didnt realise I'd gone!
[17:27] #knownspace> unclenasty: farside :)
[17:27] #knownspace> vilstef: Only movie I'm anxious to see at the moment is True Grit.
[17:27] #knownspace> SeanS: there is a big difference i know. i used the wrong term
[17:27] #knownspace> unclenasty: your last message came through just as you quit
[17:27] #knownspace> AlexA: Yeah, the moon has no darkside
[17:27] #knownspace> Jim: Peer Gynt?
[17:28] #knownspace> AlexA: TG has had good reviews
[17:28] #knownspace> unclenasty: AlexA, Just the one by pink floyd
[17:28] #knownspace> NickE: Think I'm giving up on seeing movies in teh cinema. 10 fucking quid for a standard seat now
[17:28] #knownspace> AlexA: Don't get to cinema much
[17:28] #knownspace> NickE: And it wa for Tron Legacy, Gah!
[17:29] #knownspace> unclenasty: not been to the cinema in ages. I don't find it enjoyable any more
[17:29] #knownspace> unclenasty: i could cheerfully throttle most of the other patrons
[17:29] #knownspace> AlexA: How was TL NickE ?
[17:29] #knownspace> vilstef: I haven't been to a movie theater since I saw Coraline
[17:29] #knownspace> NickE: Oh hi Alex
[17:29] #knownspace> NickE: It sucked
[17:29] #knownspace> unclenasty: it was pretty, but it was nothing else
[17:29] #knownspace> Akiraa: Watch the new Tron in 2d, it's simply better
[17:29] #knownspace> NickE: Basically a 3d retread of the original and not as good or well paced
[17:29] #knownspace> SeanS: i quit going to theaters after we are marshall. about destroyed 4 kids cell phones and some woman messed with my hair and when she realized she didnt know me just mumbled a sorry
[17:30] #knownspace> NickE: I hate 3D. Its a bloody film, I want it flat!
[17:30] #knownspace> Akiraa: lol, yes, they should just jam cell phones in cinema
[17:30] #knownspace> unclenasty: the earliest sunday show, or the early midweek shows, when the kids are at school, are _just_ do-able
[17:30] #knownspace> NickE: Didn't have the option locally - which we didnt realise till we went
[17:30] #knownspace> AlexA: Only 'new' 3d I've seen was Toy Story 3
[17:31] #knownspace> unclenasty: anyways, nice to chat, y'all
[17:31] #knownspace> unclenasty: I have to depart
[17:31] #knownspace> SeanS: told the manager i would never go to a theater again and he smugly said 'guess you will have to wait for dvd' i said yeah right
[17:31] #knownspace> vilstef: Yeah, keep it 2d-poking stuff at you doesn't advance the story
[17:31] #knownspace> Akiraa: city of ember is worth watching
[17:31] #knownspace> AlexA: Didn't add anything but gave me a headache
[17:31] #knownspace> NickE: bue Neil
[17:31] #knownspace> NickE: bye even.. oh top late
[17:32] #knownspace> NickE: too late
[17:32] #knownspace> NickE: feck
[17:32] #knownspace> Jim: bye; too late
[17:32] #knownspace> AlexA: Better go myself
[17:32] #knownspace> AlexA: .w egdm
[17:32] #knownspace> Outsider: Couldn't get any definitions for egdm.
[17:32] #knownspace> NickE: Yeah, the kids didnt even want to go see Dawn Treader once they found out it was 3D.... which was a relief: I have 4 kids!
[17:33] #knownspace> AlexA: .weather eddm
[17:33] #knownspace> Outsider: Cover Unknown, 0℃, 1013mb, Shallow Fog, N SC, Light breeze 9km/h (5kt) (↑) - EDDM, 23:20, 2220Z
[17:33] #knownspace> Jim: .w shooting AZ
[17:33] #knownspace> Outsider: Couldn't get any definitions for shooting AZ.
[17:33] #knownspace> AlexA: .weather egdm
[17:33] #knownspace> Outsider: Cover Unknown, 0℃, 1004mb, N CD, Gentle breeze 7kt (↑) - EGDM, 21:50, 2150Z
[17:33] #knownspace> NickE: @Sean <ahem>
[17:33] #knownspace> SeanS: lol
[17:33] #knownspace> Akiraa: I fantasize about future cinemas which features a volumetric display, with the audience arranged in an amphitheater style...
[17:33] #knownspace> Jim: .g AZ shooting
[17:33] #knownspace> Outsider: Jim: http://arizonashooting.com/
[17:34] #knownspace> Akiraa: like theater, but with virtual characters
[17:34] #knownspace> AlexA: .g rep giffords shooting
[17:34] #knownspace> Outsider: AlexA: http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2011/01/08/20110108arizona-giffords-brk.html
[17:34] #knownspace> SeanS: tis a nice bot
[17:34] #knownspace> AlexA: Google-fu
[17:35] #knownspace> AlexA: Oddly I've got a rep as ace Google-wrangler in my office :)
[17:35] #knownspace> Akiraa: and... before the film starts, the cinema sends an EMP through the audience seats to fry all cellphones that are not closed
[17:35] #knownspace> NickE: heh#
[17:36] #knownspace> Akiraa: too harsh?
[17:36] #knownspace> vilstef: I'm the goto guy for many of my friends on internet searches
[17:36] #knownspace> NickE: nope
[17:36] #knownspace> SeanS: my google fu has been called good as well, but I supplement with binary group searches
[17:36] #knownspace> NickE: hmm. I have a half dcent LCD TV now...with a USB socket...just sayin
[17:37] #knownspace> AlexA: My trick is to think of unique search terms
[17:38] #knownspace> NickE: And they wonder why folk take....a;ternative routes to watching stuff
[17:38] #knownspace> AlexA: Ok off now
[17:38] #knownspace> NickE: TTFN
[17:38] #knownspace> AlexA: See you guys
[17:38] #knownspace> vilstef: A useful thing is to put + between your search terms
[17:38] #knownspace> Jim: bye
[17:41] #knownspace> Jim: .g great american beer drinker
[17:41] #knownspace> Outsider: Jim: http://www.wynkoop.com/2011-search
[17:42] #knownspace> SeanS: is it a picture of me?
[17:44] #knownspace> SeanS: who did the book with the space dragons that have inertialess drive?
[17:44] #knownspace> Jim: nope, just a annual contest to find the most knowledgeable beer drinker in US
[17:45] #knownspace> SeanS: reaching way back in my memory for that book or books
[17:45] #knownspace> NickE: That sounds like one of the post Lensman serie sequels
[17:45] #knownspace> Fred: MOON is on netflix instant that we just signed up for
[17:45] #knownspace> Fred: added it to my queue
[17:45] #knownspace> NickE: Or one of the Lensman series
[17:45] #knownspace> SeanS: dont think it was smith
[17:46] #knownspace> NickE: Oh Moon was quite good
[17:46] #knownspace> Jim: is there is no inertia, what is to prevent infinite velocities?
[17:46] #knownspace> Jim: S /is/If/
[17:46] #knownspace> SeanS: well maybe not inertia but some type of living space drive
[17:47] #knownspace> NickE: The idea was the desity of teh interstellar medium became the limiting factor - so ships were streamlined and power packed
[17:47] #knownspace> SeanS: yeah... that was the lensman series thingy... this was living creatures
[17:47] #knownspace> NickE: ah
[17:48] #knownspace> Jim: etheric density or the # of atoms per cubic meter density
[17:48] #knownspace> SeanS: .g space dragons
[17:48] #knownspace> Outsider: SeanS: http://spacedragonsblog.blogspot.com/
[17:48] #knownspace> Fred: Obama sends FBI director to Tucson to investigate
[17:49] #knownspace> SeanS: dont think thats what i was looking for
[17:50] #knownspace> SeanS: the obvious question there is why send a senate approved administrator instead of an investigator
[17:50] #knownspace> Fred: along with 'does the FBI even have jurisdiction?'
[17:51] #knownspace> SeanS: its not interstate. but does involve a US Rep
[17:51] #knownspace> SeanS: oversight maybe
[17:52] #knownspace> SeanS: if they call it terrorism yes
[17:53] #knownspace> SeanS: but now adays if i fart while crossing the street outside of a cross walk it could be terrorism
[17:54] #knownspace> Fred: Jared Lee Loughner, identified today as the shooter responsible for the mass shooting this morning in Tucson which took the life of federal court judge John Roll and critically injured Democrat U.S. Representative Gabrielle Giffords, lists The Communist Manifesto and Mein Kampf among his favorite books.
[17:55] #knownspace> SeanS: hmm, the manifesto was a pamphlet wasnt it?
[17:55] #knownspace> Fred: shooter left videos calling himself a terrorist
[17:56] #knownspace> Fred: carte blanch for the FBI
[17:56] #knownspace> SeanS: yep
[17:56] #knownspace> Fred: the weapon used was a pistol with an extended magazine
[17:57] #knownspace> SeanS: i am sure i can get a 30 round clip for the beretta but have never looked for one
[17:59] #knownspace> Jim: a commie and a nazi?
[17:59] #knownspace> vilstef: Why is there no infinite improbability pistol outside of old westerns?
[17:59] #knownspace> SeanS: heh
[18:00] #knownspace> Fred: I always loved the Rifleman opening
[18:01] #knownspace> Fred: shoots, what, 20, 30 times?
[18:01] #knownspace> SeanS: it was a lot
[18:01] #knownspace> vilstef: A commie/nazi-the worst kind of terrorist. More dangerous than muppets-see receent Get Fuzzy strips.
[18:02] #knownspace> vilstef: Dunno how many shots The Rifleman fired, 8 at least.
[18:02] #knownspace> Fred: sounds like 12
[18:02] #knownspace> Fred: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IX2oZ6Kv_qo
[18:03] #knownspace> SeanS: was it a henry rifle?
[18:05] #knownspace> Fred: lol, it's an 11 shot rifle he fires 13 times in the open :)
[18:06] #knownspace> Fred: I've read that it was the trick rifle the Duke used in his movies, dunno if it's true
[18:08] #knownspace> vilstef: Sounds like an infinite improbability firearm to me.:)
[18:08] #knownspace> Fred: mdified winchester 92 rifle
[18:08] #knownspace> Fred: LOL! The rifle has it's own Wiki!
[18:08] #knownspace> Fred: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Rifleman%27s_Rifle
[18:10] #knownspace> Fred: "The 1892 Winchester rifle was a descendant of the Henry rifle"
[18:13] #knownspace> Jim: according to Wiki, it just fired 12 times in the pilot
[18:14] #knownspace> Fred: the rifleman wiki says 13, the rifleman's rifle wiki says 12 :)
[18:15] #knownspace> Fred: the former says it fired 12 and they dubbed in a 13 sound effect to fit the music pacing
[18:16] #knownspace> vilstef: Lucky there were no Presidents around-13 the 'magic' bullet!
[18:16] #knownspace> Fred: I built a replica of the Rifleman's gun but made it 3" too short
[18:17] #knownspace> NickE: bhl
[18:17] #knownspace> vilstef: LOL-there's that number again
[18:17] NickE has joined #knownspace
[18:17] #knownspace> NickE: yep. Eris gives no indication that I've been kicked off
[18:18] #knownspace> vilstef: A lot of coming & going Nick!
[18:18] #knownspace> NickE: odd, I't been OK before
[18:19] #knownspace> NickE: just like old times :-)
[18:22] #knownspace> NickE: has it done it again?
[18:22] #knownspace> NickE: no, just quiet
[18:27] #knownspace> vilstef: I hear crickets. I answered two emails since I put in my previous comment.
[18:28] #knownspace> SeanS: sorry... julie wanted me in the other room
[18:29] #knownspace> SeanS: i put on radio margaritaville... maybe that will make me feel like i am in a warmer area... Fu KIng cold outside
[18:30] #knownspace> SeanS: .weather 40601
[18:30] #knownspace> Outsider: Overcast ☁, 17.6℉ (-8℃), 30.03in (1014mb), Gentle breeze 9kt (↑) - KLOU 17:53, 2253Z
[18:30] #knownspace> vilstef: Well, I have to run myself, need to go to the pharmacy and do some other errands-should've done them earlier
[18:30] #knownspace> vilstef: Bye for now
[18:37] #knownspace> NickE: gotta go bed
[18:37] #knownspace> NickE: night
[18:41] #knownspace> Fred: was prepping dinner
[18:41] #knownspace> Fred: so is "Lensman-Free" Sooby, and he's free, or is it somebody else who is free of Sooby?
[19:08] #knownspace> SeanS: 51 new niven list messages in an hour... i see heavy use of the delete button
[19:08] #knownspace> Jim: Sooby is Lensman-free when he is not at the computer.
[19:09] #knownspace> SeanS: yeah.. fred is just being a smart ass and picking on lensman... which i encourage. its so easy.
[19:16] #knownspace> Fred: No, I wasn't
[19:17] #knownspace> Fred: I honestly don't know how to connect nicknames here to platter names
[19:17] #knownspace> SeanS: platter names?
[19:17] #knownspace> Fred: I don't know who Akiraa or CrazyEddy or knownspaceARM or Lensman-Free aree
[19:17] #knownspace> Fred: sorry, mailing list names
[19:17] #knownspace> Fred: 'platter' is my animation chat rooom
[19:18] #knownspace> SeanS: akiraa is a guy in like bulgaria or something
[19:18] #knownspace> SeanS: eddy lives in australia
[19:18] #knownspace> Fred: is that ted?
[19:18] #knownspace> SeanS: ARM is the log bot
[19:18] #knownspace> SeanS: no
[19:18] #knownspace> Fred: k
[19:18] #knownspace> SeanS: Lensman-Free is his nick when away
[19:18] #knownspace> Fred: on the platter we all use nicknames but there's a function to 'get real name'
[19:19] #knownspace> SeanS: sorry for assuming ;)
[19:19] #knownspace> Fred: no prob
[19:19] #knownspace> SeanS: no worries here either
[19:20] #knownspace> Fred: I never remember who the hell you are on facebook half the time 'cause the platter has a Sean S too :D
[19:20] #knownspace> SeanS: email me how to join the platter
[19:21] #knownspace> Fred: k
[19:22] #knownspace> Fred: won't be of much interest unless you do CGI in Electric Image or C4D :)
[19:23] #knownspace> SeanS: So. could be fun looking up terms.. everybody in here is tech interested.
[19:23] #knownspace> Akiraa: "<SeanS> akiraa is a guy in like bulgaria or something" no, but close enough :) a little north to that
[19:23] #knownspace> SeanS: sorry, i cant remember
[19:25] #knownspace> SeanS: fred, i dont know if facebook does this but in skype you can rename me to anything
[19:28] #knownspace> SeanS: Akiraa, I can't remember where everyone is... just glad I got close.
[19:28] #knownspace> SeanS: didnt we do a map thing at some point?
[19:33] #knownspace> Fred: Akiraa is in The Great Ocean :)
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[20:03] #knownspace> growler: Another gorgeous day in paradfise. Well, apart from the earthquakes.
[20:31] #knownspace> Fred: and who was "Growler"?
[20:58] Xenovalent has joined #knownspace